How Well Does Bribery Work?

Discussion in 'onTopic' started by Kita, 17 Sep 2015.

  1. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    I can't get a company to acknowledge me, can't get a phone number from their website, can't get their attention. I am a perfect fit for the posted position. No clue if it is even still open, how long it has been up. No one sees me, and I live too far away to walk in the office. I have long since blown through all my money while going to school.

    So I have a plan.

    I have been working on some items at a makerspace to sell to a family friend's gift shop for her to sell. I think I might be able to talk her into trading me half the money in store credit, and pick up some little boutique gift basket snacks. I will fill it out with organic nuts, dried fruit, and chocolate from Trader Joes. Then use the rest of the money for shipping. Tape my fucking resume and cover letter to the top of the basket, and send it to the office.

    Is that creepy? Is a bribe gonna make me look slimy and fuck me? Any experience with drastic measures to get a resume into someone's hands? It's a hail mary, cause I need the money from the sale, but I need a job more than anything... and if the position is no longer available... :/

    plzkthx?
     
  2. Lain

    Lain End of line. #resist
    Sneaky

    Oftentimes, at least with the security types I run around with, they find those posted positions are mere formalities to meet the legal requirements and the candidate they want for the position has already been chosen. Depending on the size of the company, there might be some "I've got a friend/relative" stuff happening.

    Please don't let that discourage you. There's a large pool of people that are pumped out with half-ass textbook educations and no actual knowledge of hands-on experience in the field disrupting things as companies, usually the larger ones, prefer to pick up these half-wits as they know enough to be functional but not enough to avoid being molded into whatever model the company has adopted as the best one to fight the bad-guys.

    There are basically two schools of though in the Security industry as a whole. It boils down to, "security is not a priority, we're doing what's needed to meet the insurance requirements and nothing extra can be worked into the budget, that's what insurance is for." And then there's "security is more important than breathing, and OUR security model is the BEST one out there.... we're the shit, come and get some hackers!"

    I am wrong for both types of thought. I am sure based on interactions with you here, that you will find a similar fit when you really get into the thick of it.

    What does that mean? Well, it means that you're going to have to forge your own niche. Either take a half-ass job and pretend to know less than the person in charge of you (and probably in charge of him) when actually you have forgotten more than they will ever know about technology. Or freelance.

    If you take the half-ass job, the one that probably could care less about security, it will drive you nuts internally, but can benefit you overall. You'll have access to high-speed and servers connected to high-speed, can setup remote administration tasks and generally run your own shop as long as you're smiling when you see them and make the rounds to say, "hey how's it going is your shit running well, awesome let me know if I can get you a new mouse or whatever, see ya' and their computers stay up no one will give a shit what you're doing.

    Freelancing is not easy, I still have to troll for contracts even as long as I have been doing it. Contacts are beneficial. It's good to know the local Verizon guy, the High-speed providers and their techs, etc. If you see the charter guy chat him up. Sure he's a useless, ignorant dick but he might know someone or refer you somewhere, etc.
    I don't know where I was going with this, I'm relaxing today and for some reason the text is pouring out of my keyboard.

    TLDR;

    Don't send the fruitbasket, it's weird, but I still think you're cool, I'm weird too. I'm here, aren't I? ;)
     
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  3. Lain

    Lain End of line. #resist
    Sneaky

    I remember my original point that I lost while rambling above.....

    Few people will understand or seem to care about security as much as you do. Find the ones that do, make allies with them. Spend time bashing your respected peers that pretend to be in the know but are so far lost it's crazy.

    Never contradict, always suggest in a way that makes it look like their idea when dealing with knowitall types. I like to pull this trick where you pretend they said it before and you're just proceeding with their request..... "Ok I'm going to change out those VPN passwords like you recommended. you were right 30 days is a good interval for those we should put it in the calendar so no one forgets."

    He feels like he did something great, you've praised him. It wasn't his idea, but he won't challenge you because he doesn't want to seem like he's forgetful and can't recall the conversation you're talking about. When someone comes along and says, "Bob, changing those passwords every 30 days was a sweet idea", and pats him on the back, he'll remember you reminded him of his 'great idea' and now he owes you. ;)

    Rambling again. I'm obviously totally baked today. :)
     
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  4. Lain

    Lain End of line. #resist
    Sneaky

    We should make a thread where we can exchange social engineering and hacking tips. As I'm typing this I realize I could be creating that thread instead. :/
     
  5. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    I have been doing some networking, and doing basically exactly what you said. Snerking about idiots but still doing the shit that needs to be done. I did it with THREE people at the Microsoft thing before being very diplomatic with the Microsoft cheerleaders. No one was impressed with what we saw, and all three people I talked too work primarily with Microsoft products. They aren't biased, they just know when shit sucks, like I do. :p

    I tend to get a little nervous and clam up when I am forging ahead and doing something the right way instead of the 'company' way, or how my coworkers do it. I play supervisor tag, telling my direct supervisor their boss told me to do it like that, and their boss that my direct supervisor told me to do it like that. No one gets in trouble that way, even the person below the boss because all my bosses have always respected how their supervisors run house since there never was actually anything WRONG, just micromanagement BS. I just constantly got this EXACT line from the series of bosses and supervisors; "Well, do it THEIR way when they are around, otherwise, do it MY way." orly? That's what I was doing already, you just caught me ;)

    The plan is to get into enterprise and do my time so I learn more and get paid to do it. Once I have learned a shitload with references and experience to back it up, I am taking my squirreled away contacts with me so I can go back to consulting and contract work. The guppy clients don't pay the bills. Once I meet some whales, I only need to work a few months a year at it, and can take as much or little work as I need. Hope to have it going by the time I am 40, so I can work on my TV shows full time and fund it with contracting/ consulting work. That's the plan, at least. I am thinking infrastructure planning of some kind. Or upgrade deployment planning. Basically assessing the needs then coming up with a plan to meet them. It would be short gigs that are paid well, and is just reliant on knowing my shit, making some nice papers and powerpoints with my geek all over them, and talking to upper management. Easy peasy. Might even hang around for some deployments to oversee them for extra easy monies. I just feel I have a ton to learn still, and being in the middle of enterprise is the best way to do this.

    I have gotten burned many times by postings that were perfect for me, but meant for internal candidates. This one was actually written by hand, differently than all the others, and focused a lot on the 'type' of person they were looking for more than skills of a person already tapped. The skills requested are super basic and generic, but the type of person and work style is very specific; they are looking for me, I think. I am being carefully optimistic. The company sounds like an amazing culture kind of place, and supposedly will be giving me pretty much complete autonomy to do whatever I feel needs to be done around the office. And encourage me to learn more. Since it is a programming op, I would leap on the opportunity to latch onto an enthusiastic mentor and finally learn some fucking coding.

    My biggest concern is that it is too low paying. It is smackdab in the middle of downtown in a big city. I don't want to go through all the song and dance, be chosen, then get a shit offer that I can't live off of. I need more to work in the middle of the city than somewhere outside. That scares me. Especially in a big city and away from any support or help. I also get anxiety about overselling myself, not being as good as I think/ say I am, being in over my head and losing my job. Stuck in the middle of a big city, over my nose in debt from moving expenses, with a dunce cap on my resume, and I would be TOTALLY FUCKED. More fucked than if I took a job beneath my skills and scraped by on shit compensation. So there is that. :/
     
  6. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    I wanna mad h@x0r$ some shit! :p

    Nothing says 'Hire Me' like placing your own resume into the finalists pile in the HR system. ;)

    I ked! I ked!

    ...can I do that? :p
     
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  7. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    I found some buttons on the website I hadn't pushed yet and pushed them. I got a response! YAY. Sent a THIRD resume and cover letter. If they find all three, which are all different since it changes weekly when someone else looks at it and rips it apart, I might look like a crazy. I just want to make sure a human sees it, because humans see about .1% of the crap I have been sending out, and I have a MUCH better batting average when I have a chance to talk to a human. And if it is thrown into an ATS system, hopefully one of them makes it happy...

    ugh. Job hunt. Got a call from a corporate hell-hole locally for initial screen. They liked what they heard from me, and it sounds like they are looking to hire a few miscellaneous drones. I don't want to work for them, but I will still do everything I can to get the job. As long as they pay me enough to put up with their shit, I will put up with it and get my time in. I also don't want to stay in town, but obviously, it would be a lot easier to move into an apartment than relocate. An easy move and reasonable local cost of living (especially in the boonies where they are) is the only shining point.
     
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  8. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    I GOT THE INTERVIEW!! Tomorrow!! OMFG!! No fruit basket needed!! Wish me luck~!!

    It is a Google Hangouts one. I know the basic rules (quiet room, stable connection, plain background, dress like its an interview, treat it like an interview), but any other advice for this type of interview? Never done a remote one before.
     
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  9. Lain

    Lain End of line. #resist
    Sneaky

    AWESOME!

    Be yourself. I have a good feeling that your best asset is your personality.

    Good luck!
     
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  10. Bunnie

    Bunnie Everybody loves the sunshine.
    Baked

    Kita, I am and will be thinking about how much ass you will kick on this interview. Seriously, in the bag. :cheergirl:
     
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  11. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    Ok, I was thinking of another thread.

    See what kind of trouble your ADD multi-tabbing gets you into, missy?!!
     
    Last edited: 23 Sep 2015
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  12. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    Oh, and as a good omen, my ram upgrade arrived 2 days early, in time for stabalizing the laptop for the interview! Running mem test now, rick solid so far with zero errors :D

    I stressed over having to buy a webcam along with a headset (needed a new headset anyways, that one is no biggie). Went to set up the meeting room today, and I find a webcam someone randomly left! A really nice one too! Tried it out, worked great, looks great! Another good omen! :D
     
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  13. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    Waiting to hear back sucks even more than waiting to do the interview... :/
     
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  14. Bunnie

    Bunnie Everybody loves the sunshine.
    Baked

    I hear you. How do you feel it went?
     
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  15. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    Good, not great. I rambled a bit. I do that, and it is really bad when I am nervous. I really tried to keep things focused and in control, but it didn't go as well as I wanted. I hope they still heard what they wanted to hear though. It was definitely a 'first' interview, there will be more if they liked me.
     
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  16. Lain

    Lain End of line. #resist
    Sneaky

    I never think it goes as well as I planned either. And then I get a call to show up and sign the contracts.

    I'm my own worst critic. Something tells me we share this trait.

    :D
     
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  17. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    I am a horrible critic to my self :p

    I had another initial screening interview a few days ago as well. I thought it went very meh, and I felt meh about the position, mostly cause it is in town. I was contacted today about scheduling a second interview. So I am getting some traction.

    I just really want to work for this particular company in Seattle. They sound like the bees knees. Good culture, and they want to teach me about their stuff instead of stuffing me in a cubicle with a phone. I found out the office I applied to is the hub for consulting too, along with Developers for working with the customers, so this is seriously the fast track for 'Kita's Big Plans' if I can nail it.

    I went over in my head all kinds of good answers to potential questions. I was only asked one of them, and still stumbled over what I wanted to say. Didn't get an opportunity to blow them away by elaborating on super geeky projects, and I stumbled over a simple troubleshooting role play (but still solved it and kept my cool and personable demeanor.) Hoping I get points for what I did right, even if I don't think I was overly impressive.
     
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  18. Bunnie

    Bunnie Everybody loves the sunshine.
    Baked

    Lain really is her own worst critic as well. She's also super organized and a perfectionist. I love my lady. It can get a bit overwhelming to deal with it all. We manage. I'm what I call messy organized. :confused: I am a "do the best you can" kinda gal myself. :D
     
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  19. Kita

    Kita Should Update Title

    The anxiety is eating me up inside. I don't know if it is a good or bad thing that I haven't heard back yet. I think it is a 'we are exploring all our options' thing, and they are doing more interviews because they weren't impressed.

    I sent thank you notes with questions in them, so I could gauge interest. Have not heard back from them, which really worries me. I am probably just jumping the gun because I am anxious...

    I'm worried because it has always been a bad sign when interviewers blow me off, based on past experiences. I have literally been dodged after every interview for positions I didn't get. No answer either way, dodge all attempts at contact. How shitty is that of people to blow someone off like that?? Grow a pair and just tell me you don't want to hire me! That shit just REALLY rubbed me the wrong way during the last job hunt, and I don't want it to happen again. It is that lack of conviction thing I mentioned before, I think. People can be so spineless sometimes, they don't want others to hate them, so they don't want to be the 'bearers of bad news'. Have a secretary do it! I have had to call and pester secretaries weeks later to get an answer. Seriously?? The secretaries have gotten shitty with me before too, saying 'Well, if they aren't calling you, you should just assume they don't want to hire you.' Very, very unprofessional, lady.

    But, then again, all the jobs I have interviewed for and gotten were not professional positions. I was hired on the spot, basically, for all of them-- I knew at the end they wanted to move forward. Professional can be a bit more evasive because it is a bigger decision, hence stomach in knots. These guys were evasive about when I would hear back, which wasn't a good sign for me and how I knew it wasn't stellar. They seemed engaged and interested in me, smiled a lot and such, but they might just be nice guys. I guess a flat out 'no' from a secretary the next day would have been bad too, and i didn't get that...

    Ugh. All knotted up inside. :/
     
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  20. Lain

    Lain End of line. #resist
    Sneaky

    I just opened my eyes and that's a large amount of text to intake right now but I took the core of it and processed it.

    Just relax. It's only been a few days. I don't know about the internal structure of the company that you are dealing with but the usual response time in my experience is 3-5 business days, so I wouldn't begin to be concerned until middle of next week.

    Has the application period closed? Some businesses will wait until that day to announce the new choice regardless of whether it's been made or not because of legal reasons, or internal policies which dictate such things.

    So, take a long walk, play some video games, or whatever and try to push it out of your mind. When it's about to kill you, that's when they'll call.

    Hugz
     
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